Thinking about a CCL & gun, suggestions?

Bob-STL said:
If you are concealed carrying a semi automatic without a thumb safety, do you do so with a round already chambered?

Any suggestions, comments?

Bob
Click to expand...

Bob,

The 100-year-old technology of a thumb safety has been superseded by far better safety methods. It is totally unnecessary and unwanted on a modern CC handgun.
The best CC handguns have both a trigger safety and grip safety and both are engaged without conscious thought... by design.
This firearm cannot fire unless BOTH the grip safety is depressed by your hand AND the trigger safety is depressed by your trigger finger.
If only one is depressed...the weapon will not fire.

In the stressful situation of having to defend yourself or your family you do not want to have to think...do I have a round in the chamber...is my gun on safe...or not???
When faced with a threat...you have to react in milliseconds. ANY time spent fumbling with your firearm can be fatal.

Modern handguns, by design, can be carried with a round in the chamber...( and SHOULD be)..!
Not having a round chambered can get you killed. You can guarantee that any weapon pointed at you by a threat...has a live round in his chamber.

I don't know what training you have had...but would strongly recommend that you attend a current handgun course taught by experienced and reputable instructors.
It would first make you a more effective shooter and perhaps, more importantly, allow you to feel safer when carrying a handgun in Condition 1 with a round in the chamber.

My recommendation as I have mentioned before...would be Asymmetric Solutions in Farmington. A "Basics of Tactical Shooting" Course would be where to start:
http://www.asymmetricsolutionsusa.com/civilian-course-list/

As mentioned earlier in this thread I have carried a lot of different model handguns over the years. None have impressed me more than the Springfield XD Mod 2 that I currently carry.
IMHO they are head and shoulders over any Glock made.

I strongly endorse it for its accuracy, ergonomics, excellent design, and reliability.

In standard form, they are very compact, relatively light, have excellent fiber optics sights, 17 round capacity, and a good trigger.
The only modification they need is a $10 Pierce finger rest added to the magazine bottom plate to provide improved support for your little finger.

Add the finger rest...spend some time at the range shooting and getting familiar with the weapon and they are GTG.

pierce mag extension.JPG


Right now would be an excellent time to buy an XD Mod 2:

Academy Sports has the XD Mod 2 with 3" barrel on sale thru Nov 10th...For $379.
If you are a veteran you can apply online and get an additional 10% discount at $342. However, be advised that the Military discount expires Nov 11th.

That is a steal for a handgun that normally sells for $479 +.

xd mod 2.jpg

Bob...if you have not fired an XD Mod 2 and are planning to be at Rich's bonfire this Saturday...you would be more than welcome to fire my weapon. Just LMK and I will bring extra ammo and magazines.
 
Kerry,

If you don't mind, yes I would like to try it Saturday.

I have some remington 9mm fmj 115 grain that I can bring.

One question, do you have the factory installed trigger, or have you installed another trigger?

Bob
 
Bob, I'm hoping to get there early enough to do a little shooting as well (depends on when Ann gets home, we'll leave then).
I plan to bring my 9mm Springfield Armory Mod2. You are more than welcome to shoot it if you like.

I do like to shoot it, but I feel it may be too bulky for a comfortable CC.
Earlier this year, I bought a Ruger .380 and it is much smaller.
 
Here’s my 2 cents...I prefer 9mm as Kerry says, knock out power...but remember consequences possible when you kill someone (if not a time of conflict or war)...training is one thing...know your weapon (to dismantle and clean) I suggest this as the first step prior to CCW license training. ULITMATE DEFENSE (owned by Cops) is a great training/shooting range...( they have weekend classes) off Rte79-google it....I have a GLOCK 9mm also a Ruger 22 that Barbie uses. As you progress, in your shooting...knees, feet, hips...vs. torso kill shot... is a suggested approach. My son-in-law Officer Jason (20 yr police career) is more than happy to help and assist...instructor certified. He just got me a custom assualt rifle-bump stock-custom made 9mm-30 round clips...and had hoped to give everyone a go at Bonfire, sadly will miss this year as I can not leave Barbie alone this early after her foot surgery done two days ago......my vote Glock 9mm (downside no safety-chamber a round and your ready to shoot) ... conceled carry weapon use, needs to be an un-conscience effort, and this will come with proper training and practice. FYI -Jason is required every 90 days to comply with 10 hours of range shooting time....he carries 100% of time, and his use is totally un-conscience (meaning he does not need to think, it is automatic reactions)....it’s like driving your Cobra coming into a hard turn, you automatically do what you need to do to make the corner vs. thinking what do... if that were the case, you’re in the ditch....un-conscience reactions...pro-active ALWAYS trumps Re-active...get it done!
 
I would like to comment on Marks reference to smaller handgun comfort.

First, I agree that a double stack 9mm like the XD Mod 2 can be a bit large for “comfortable” CC. But allow me to explain why I switched from a Keltec PF-9…a CC pistol very comparable to the Ruger LCP in size….to the XD Mod 2.

First, the LCP can carry only a maximum of 7 rounds of .380.
The Keltec PF-9 carried a maximum of 8 rounds of 9mm.

Both are easier to conceal than the XD Mod 2 having a 17 round capacity and generally more comfortable to carry.

However, two incidents convinced me to relegate the Keltec ONLY as a secondary back up sidearm:

First was an incident at a North KC gunshop four years ago where three black males entered the gunshop and were obviously casing the store for a robbery. Kathy was in our car on the street and witnessed the three in hoodies enter the store while one stood guard at the door scanning the street. Fortunately for all involved… the presence of two armed employees and one CC customer (me) convinced them to go elsewhere that day.

The second was a defensive pistol course taken at AS where we were taught to engage five multiple threats at a distance of 7 yards. We had to draw from our holster on command of “threat” …and place three hits on each of the five targets spread 15 ft apart…as quickly as possible. If you missed any of your shots…you had to continue shooting until three good hits on each of the five targets was made. The fastest time by our instructor was 1.43 seconds. The fastest student was 1.73 sec. What stood out was that had I been carrying my Keltec…I could engage only half of the five threats. This is an important point when we see reports of multiple gang members assaulting civilians on the street…or roving mobs of Antifa members attacking innocent bystanders.

The takeaway is that a 7 or 8 round CC handgun is insufficient to counter potential threats we may experience in places like downtown STL. Even with a tactical mag change…you are still fighting a losing battle where finishing second place means you may be highly unlikely to survive.

Keep in mind too that unless you train constantly…not every round you fire is going to hit your target. Even the best shooters will miss under stress.

Keep in mind also, that the human body can take multiple rifle hits to the center of mass and even to the head….and continue to fight and return fire. There are documented examples of soldiers being shot as many as 18 times by rifle fire…and still being able to return fire killing their attackers. And…handgun rounds are far less effective than rifle rounds.

A limited 7-8 round magazine capacity is simply not enough to ensure a successful defense.

Yes…a large capacity CC handgun can be less comfortable to carry. But comfort takes a back seat when effectiveness in countering a threat or multiple threats is all that matters.

I would MUCH rather have the benefit of a 15-19 round capacity handgun (with a second matching capacity magazine in my pocket) than rely on a limited capacity handgun that may not be capable of defending myself or Kathy in a worst-case scenario.

Even 18 rounds of 9mm are no guarantee that you will survive a gunfight…but it can dramatically improve your odds.

The Keltec PF9 or Ruger LCP can be fine backup handguns. But they should only compliment your larger high capacity primary CC handgun. Not replace it. Regardless of any comfort disadvantage.
 
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