Being deprived

A

A Snake

Member #024
Location (City)
McLeansboro, Il
First Name
Mike
Last Name
Woley
Mark-Tim
You are killing me...let me post ..
I am having anxiety attacks..
can't eat
can't sleep
smoking too many cig's
drinking too much caffiene
thinking about buying a dog to have something to kick
 
thats funny have dog i will lone you caution he does bite he digs up moles tho makes your yard look nice
 
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Mark and I spoke briefly last night. He is in the middle of an office re-model/redo and won't be here over the next couple of days. Although our initial thought is to shut down the Paddock, many have sent us PM's with some good points. Will talk to Mark more this evening. What we're having trouble dealing with is out of the entire membership, there are one or two that take liberties with the Paddock's 'freedom of speech' idea. :rolleyes: But, we won't risk having personal attacks, 'yelling' or broken friendships because of the political environment we live in. We're all car guys, why can't we find enough to talk about BESIDES politics?
 
I understand completely...my post was meant as humor.
I do enjoy this site because it is active with good input.
As far as the Paddock goes....I like it as it gives me insight to what others are thinking about current events. Unfortunately, current events are centered around what is happening in the economy. I have spent my entire life working to provide for my family. I finally have the wherewithall to have the toys I was unable to have while getting my children thier education. I need the economy to turn around so I can get some more.
I am proud to be an American with Christian values and fear losing them with what is happening in our Capitol.
They are making me feel helpless at this point because they don't care what the American majorty are concerned about.

When Mark started the Paddock for members only he prefaced it with"be careful you might get an ear full"
Well when I don't want to listen to something, I turn off my hearing aid.
 
Had a panic/anxiety attack last November. Symptoms exactly like a heart attack. Sweating. Trouble breathing. Pain in chest. Felt like someone was sitting on my chest. Scared the heck out of me. Now I try not to get too upset, but it is very difficult.
 
This has been perhaps the most difficult decision/issue that our club has had to deal with since the inception of our club & the creation of the Forum & in particular "The Paddock." Karl I think you are a great guy who loves his country very much & believes very strongly in your political preferences & opinions & there is nothing wrong with that. There are others in the club on the opposite of the fence that believe just as strongly in their political preferences & opinions. They happen to be in the majority within the club & you are in the minority. The problem comes in when some of the members ratchet up the rhetoric & "piss off" a member with an opposite view.

I personally think the paddock provides all of us a wonderful opportunity to express our opinions, share our opinions & debate our opinions. We can all learn a great deal about one another, good & bad, as a result of what we say, how we respond to others & whether we are respectful, courteous & considerate to one another.

I would like to see the Paddock continue. However, how do we solve the problem that presently exists within the Paddock? Is it fair to the forum moderators that they should have to constantly monitor (a big job) the posts within the paddock & act as cops to enforce as yet un-enacted rules? I surely don't want the job, do you? Maybe we members as a whole should respond to a post that we believe is inflammatory/derisive/divisive to encourage the poster to delete or amend the post to tone down the rhetoric. Would that really work? Help out here guys I'm struggling with this one. Is there a workable solution to our dilemma or is the paddock doomed into extinction?
 
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i duly agree dave the items i put on here are jokes and information everybody has their own mind and their own beleifs i for 1 hate to see this area doomed i think there has been some over reaction on all sides i still think the best thing to do would be set up rules and those who break get access turned off for a period you abuse a privledge you lose it for week, month what ever i feel that will stop the problem but to shut it down i can,t agree on that one ---- just a thought
 
OK - David is right. This is a big decision. I personally don't want to shut down The Paddock. I enjoy it. It can be funny, thought provoking, and can sometimes add some clarity to some complicated times. BUT - I don't like babysitting adults. I think that there must be an understanding to operate this section of the forum.

1) We are all friends here - that's a baseline value and everyone needs to operate under that assumption.

2) Make your point, take your stand - BUT if you couldn't do to your friend's FACE - don't do it here.

I'm willing to try a bit longer, but mine and Tim's patience have just about expired. Let's make an effort to keep it friendly in The Paddock. You're all bright enough to make your point with being hurtful or back-handed insulting - so use that internal editor.

Pretty simply - 2 rules - don't break them.
 
OK...I've not been on the forum much lately due to other issues, but what happened recently that got everybody's panties in a bunch???

I thought the Paddock was designed for free expression without rules. Now rules are being discussed.

Mark and Tim don't want to baby sit adults... They shouldn't.

In fact I inherently disagree with any effort to be overly restrictive toward the actions of any other person. It is another incremental step that serves to reduce personal freedom and that includes freedom of expression.

And....Guess what...life is not fair. People get their feelings hurt...people in any society where values, lifestyle and background differ substantially... will get offended at some point in their lives. It is part of life. It is not something you can avoid. It is part of being able to observe contrary opinions and viewpoints...and learn to tolerate them. Not to accept them...but tolerate them. It is part of the human maturing process yet there is a substantial and growing portion of society that believe we should not have to deal with any conflicts in our lives . They are the poster children for the "Can't we all just get along" contingent. Life is full of conflict, from personal through international relations and as much as we might not like dealing with it. It is just another of life's challenges. As adults we learn to face it, tolerate it and go on. And when its' over your a better person for having addressed the challenge.

We seem to try so hard to prevent hurt feelings and avoid offending others. It seems as if political correctness has bled us of our true feelings, opinion and beliefs. That's wrong because it places severe restrictions on HONEST expressions of speech. Do you appreciate how dishonest we have become in our speech? We are so selective with our words in an effort not to offend this group or that group or this person... We have lost our ability to communicate using precise, accurate and honest dialog. We communicate today in watered down generalizations that are nothing more than mental Pablum. No expression of beliefs, of commitment to an idea or more importantly to voice opposition when it is not "mainstream".

I really believe we are making our society weaker as a whole by not teaching the younger generations how to deal with and resolve conflict. What results is new generations of Americans who are unwilling to stand up and fight for what they believe...if in fact they have any beliefs at all. More and more people are apathetic to the MANY challenges that face is as individuals and as a country. I think that many become fearful of facing these issues themselves. They rely on politicians to make decisions for them. They rely on law enforcement to protect them. They expect Government to take care of them. Any sense of personal responsibility is lost...all because they want to avoid conflict. "I just don't want to get involved"...

I will grant you that from a perspective of not wanting to be malicious or intentionally demeaning toward another person, good taste and common sense should keep a caring adult of intentionally trying to hurt someone else. However you can be tactful yet firm in defending your position on an issue without resorting to personal attacks and inflammatory rhetoric. However some individuals are thicker skinned than others and what one might consider normal aggressive banter...another person may misconstrue as being personally hurtful. Back to the previous observation... that in life... we all will be offended and hurt. Be an adult and as Don Hendley would say..."Get over it".

K&K
 
While I certainly understand whate you are saying Kerry I believe more thought needs to be put into it. If you remember I started a thread some time ago asking why we must be politically correct? This was exactly what I was referring to. Why can't we have views and not be allowed to express them anymore? Where it falls apart is honesty and frankly being an adult.

There have been numerous posts over the last 6 months that are not truthful. They are simply a posting of a mass e-mail that was sent out. I personally have noticed for some time that they have come from both sides of the politcal spectrum. Not one person is being signed out by that. The other issue is not debating but being argumentative. Again, personally I have better things to do then "piss off" a friend just to start an argument. I like this group and all the members, but I can find something else to do other than argue( I have a 4 year old and 8 year old at home, I argue with them every night to eat their dinner:D).

I like the paddock and debating and reading about the issues posted, but I think we need to ask ourselves before starting a thread or post if we are able to defend views without being argumentative and debating the issue. Yes, it will take a bit of restraint, but in the end it is well worth it. Please keep in mind that restraint does not equal censuring your view, just posting it without "trying" to piss others off. I think we would all be better off.
 
The last 4 to 5 posts in this thread are PERFECT examples of the types of respectful, intelligent, cogent & courteous posts that we should find in our forum. We are debating an issue/topic w/o resorting to inflammatory rhetoric while not necessarily agreeing with one another. Running out of time here. Will add more later.
 
Running out of time? I thought a lawyers clock had 30 hrs in a day for billing.
You must be busy; seeing you post at 1-2:00 oclock in the am. Does the wife snore or something that makes you get up that early?
Love guy...looking forward to the Supercruise with all of you
 
I wish to see the Paddock continue. However I would also like to see those who have posted inflammatory rhetoric therein to tone it down. It is IMHO not an issue of freedom of expression/speech but more of an issue of human conduct which is not healthy or in the best interest of our club. Our club should be about friendships & having fun, not about provoking one another with insensitive inflammatory rhetoric.

A famous Supreme Court Justice Brandeis(?) once said in a famous quote in a constitutional law case, that "Free speech does not mean that I can stand up in a crowded theater & yell 'Fire' when there is in fact no fire."

Common decency, respect & proper decorum require that we be considerate, polite & courteous to one another when posting our opinions anywhere in the forum. We should & must refrain from & restrain ourselves from using insensitive inflammatory rhetoric when expressing our opinions in the forum out of respect for our fellow members.

Several of our members have health related issues which could be adversely affected by the unwanted stress brought about by insensitive inflammatory rhetoric. So I appeal to everyone in the club to consider carefully your choice of words & do not carelessly post insensitive inflammatory rhetoric which could be hurtful/harmful to someone else who does not share the same opinions that you do.
 
Well said Dave. Mark's been busy with his office remodel and we haven't had time to talk this through yet. Keep the discussion going, gives us more to go on. Thanks.
 
mike w said:
i duly agree dave the items i put on here are jokes and information everybody has their own mind and their own beleifs i for 1 hate to see this area doomed i think there has been some over reaction on all sides i still think the best thing to do would be set up rules and those who break get access turned off for a period you abuse a privledge you lose it for week, month what ever i feel that will stop the problem but to shut it down i can,t agree on that one ---- just a thought
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I think Mike's suggestion for progressively worse penalties for offenders is a good idea. Rules would be difficult to define & enforce. Perhaps it would be best to make a generally/loosely worded policy statement that the forum mods would use to determine when members have gone "too far" with inflammatory rhetoric. Perhaps 2 warnings followed by a week or month of loss of forum privileges for a third transgression followed by something more severe for a
4th transgression & so on.

All should not be penalized by the loss of the Paddock for the actions of a few. Only transgressors should be penalized. The Paddock serves a good purpose & should continue to be available for members to use & enjoy.

I believe that those who have been guilty of "inflammatory rhetoric" could avoid the problem by simply stating their opinions using a better choice of words. Saying that our current Pres. is a buffoon, an idiot or a jackass (I know he's a demo. who's symbol is the jackass:D) is one way of expressing your opinion, but you could certainly use a different choice of words less inflammatory to get your point across citing therein facts & not conclusions. On the other side of the fence, saying that our former Pres. & V.P. were murderers is one way of conveying your opinion, but there are better ways to communicate such an opinion without using that kind of inflammatory rhetoric. And the sad thing is that the guys who are doing it are great guys & are guys I love to hang with & cruise with. They are my friends.

OK I'm gettin off my soap box & hopefully I've beat this horse/jackass up enough. Is he dead yet?:D
 
Maybe all political responses could be sent to Dave's office for re-draft :D He seems to be good at nicely telling you all to use common sense :D Sorry Dave, couldn't resist.

Ok, I've been the 'victim' of another forum's suspension. Frankly, it pissed me off. Technically speaking, I broke a rule, which is why now I continue to post there. I haven't met one person on here that I don't like to talk cars with or go on a cruise with. It's great networking, and I enjoy the differences you all bring to the table.
 
tar and feather hmmm offender donates $2 bucks to the kitty i had that at work for cursing at the service desk in a dealership ha ha coffee money never ran dry $2.00 a curse word was much better then a write up
 
mike w said:
tar and feather hmmm offender donates $2 bucks to the kitty i had that at work for cursing at the service desk in a dealership ha ha coffee money never ran dry $2.00 a curse word was much better then a write up
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OMG you crack me up MikeyW. :D Are you saying that if we impose a monetary penalty on those who violate, an as yet undefined, policy regarding posting "insensitive inflammatory rhetoric" (my choice of words) in our forum, that you would be the biggest contributor to the fund? :D
 
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